So this happened:
And I thought I'd chime in with my .02
I caught wind of this thread that the editor of TMP began entitled "Arrogant Americans" and purported to be about substantiating or refuting claims of snobby British and arrogant American gamers (and if the hobby has an "Arrogant American" problem. How would you even rate or quantify that, let alone address it?)
My buddy Brandon, an actual rules author in his own right, made a comment about the veracity and usefulness of the thread itself after noting how many comments the editor deleted (including paying member comments). He was swiftly banned so, in solidarity with him, I made the post above right before leaving work on Friday, with the hopes that he would ban me too.
"Editor Bill" didn't disappoint and I was kicked off TMP before I even got off the train. Yes I kind of posted this as "click bait" for him, but TMP is that subject you talk "around" because of the sensitivity, stupidity, devotional, and almost canonical fervor of some of its loudest members about important topics to our hobby such as:
The definition of a scoundrel.
Napoleonic uniform button numbers.
The shade of musket stock wood after a long campaign.
The invincibility of British troops in the Napoleonic wars.
War of 1812 beef rations.
Defense of "Girl und Panzer" anime enthusiasts.
RT News re-posts.
In the years I've known about it, TMP has become a place where you dread starting a post almost as much as you would dread asking for a raise from your boss because you're not sure what the reaction may be to it. I never liked posting replies to questions or even starting threads myself because of this unpleasant element. So why even deal with it?
My eventual breakup with TMP was long on the horizon.
TMP's usefulness to me is touch and go. Usually when I have a research problem about historical gaming, I'm led to a TMP post via a search engine anyways. My posts were really only to help answer questions when I might actually have been able to help someone out.
So I'm done with TMP now and I'm not headed back. While occasionally helpful, it only seems to enable the slathering, dim witted, fervent trolls out there who literally have nothing better to do with their time than criticize innocent and fun loving gamers whose shade of green was too dark for their tastes.
Absolutely agree mate.
ReplyDeleteI've never been a member of TMP, but if I ever google the name of a ruleset, looking for a review, TMP always comes up.
On the occasions that I have trawled through to find comment, it appears to suffer from an undercurrent of snobbery and one-upmanship, as if some guys on there are trying to be the 'geekiest' expert they can be by slagging off other members.
Things like that keep me off forums, and focused on good blogs where we can have good discourse, and discuss rules and figures. TMP seems to have lost its way - and your comments have just underlined that.
Cheers, Darren. The unpleasantness of just reading some of the stuff on TMP outweighs any usefulness I get out of it so I am considering my relationship with TMP and its cronies terminated.
DeleteI've never been a member of TMP either, but as an old friend would say "The hell with them if they can't take a joke."
ReplyDeleteHis forum, his rules, as the TMP administrator would say. I think it's funny that he's literally nuked 20+ people over them voicing displeasure over a thread. I'm not sure if he realizes what that makes him look like?
DeleteHave been there in years for all those agreed reasons. I just made a exception to go check out this thread. Special. I see Ricard from Too Fat Lardies even commented on how inappropriate the thread was. The comment you took a pic of above appears to have joined the many other deleted ones and isn't visible...
ReplyDeleteHowever, I've found the blogosphere for our Hobby quite delightful and filled with all the people who hate that TMP troll mentality, so its not like you are cut off from the Hobby community :-)
Paul,
DeleteHe sent that comment to me in a private message on TMP that I was sure to snip before it was gone. He then deleted my post (I "was" "DisgruntledFusilier").
You're quite right though that our corner of the blogosphere is full of wonderful people. I for one get lots of inspiration from them and will continue to!
Its a pity as it was an excellent resource in its day. Since then the online Hobby has moved on - I would much rather spend that time visiting blogs and chatting with my online buddies like you :-)
DeleteI agree Paul. Time much better spent. Facebook will eventually make TMP obsolete. Most of my posting is done there now when communicating with gamers next to blogging of course.
DeleteI laughed out loud with that reply from Bill (foot in mouth). He sure has a way of ruining his own business. His business model is right up there with the best of them. It reminds me of the saying' "It's a method...Some people use it". In addition to his wonderful stewardship is the great sense of comraderie that comes up when someone provides a response to a thread such as:
ReplyDelete- What colors should my cuffs be?
- You're a jerk and stupid for even asking. You probably watch my least favorite news network as well!
Sound familiar to anyone? lol
David,
DeleteYes ive seen all that hilarity that ensues from a seemingly innocuous question. How dare any of us ask something so foolish!
Congratulations!
ReplyDeleteI got myself purposely banned 3 years ago, for more reasons than I care to recollect. My painting still gets posted now and then thanks to your friend and mine Tango01, TMP is a bit like the Hotel California "You can check out any time you like, But you can never leave!"
A couple of months ago I also "resigned" from the few forums that I'd continued to visit, changed my email address to a made up one, changed my password to something unmemorable, sent a PM to the moderators asking them to delete my account then logged out.
Forums have changed dramatically since I first started visiting them, camaraderie and humour are long since gone and have been replaced with fanatical opinions and a pack mentality.
Blogs are much better, more friendly and easier to navigate and you don't have to wade through the dross to find what it is you're looking for.
Amicalement
Steve63
Yes, I left TMP loudly (and voluntarily) last year after deciding I didn't want my ID associated with the kind of place it was becoming. I changed my username too, but after leaving, Bill changed it back, because that's obviously the kind of person he is.
DeleteBut I still sometimes get blog hits from Tango01 sharing my posts. That happens less often these days, so maybe he's got the message as well.
I confess I do sometimes head back to TMP to read some of the threads on specific boards I'm interested in.
Thanks Steve. Fanatical opinions and a pack mentality. Sounds like the political landscape on facebook as well, another place that i shudder to post on. Like you said, ill stick to blogs!
DeleteI hear you Kaptain Kobold. From all ive read and heard, bill seems very childlike with an inability to cope with those who disagree with him.
DeleteNever use TMP even when the google searches send you there. Just full of nonsense really. I like the atmosphere of blogs. But one site I miss is the steve-dean site that died 1-2 years ago. It had advice, news and even the odd gentlemanly banter but you never felt out of sorts there.
ReplyDeleteAgreed Chris, 95 percent of the thread topics are garbage or junk posts and usually only 1 or 2 are of use to me. I stand by my comment that im glad im not a paying member. I have a distinct feeling that it's going to get lonelier and lonelier for mr A.
DeleteFirst of all, thanks for the back up, Steve ;)
ReplyDeleteSecondly, I just wanted to state that, IMHO, while the TMP community has it's rough spots, it's vastly outnumbered by polite, enthusiastic, and informed folks. It was easy enough for me to ignore the troublemakers.
My only issue is with Bill the Editor. If someone more reasoned ran the place, it would be close to ideal for me. But alas... TWW is my new home. :)
No problem, Brandon. You're "one of the good guys." You can always call on this net for backup.
DeleteI have no issue with 90% of the TMP'ers. It's those nutcases on the fringe that really get my hackles up. The editor is no exception. I stopped by TWW the other day and was thinking of starting a thread called "kicked off TMP" but stopped just short of actually posting.
Welcome to a grand old club! I got banned 2-3 years ago for voicing support for AngelBarracks.
ReplyDeleteThank you sir! You are more than welcome to post and comment here.
DeleteI was banned when I supported Ken's run-in with them about a rule set, but the problem was not Ken's review of the ruleset in question [which was excellent], but rather one particular person who was insulting and degrading, and wasn't being dog-housed for it. Ken made a hilarious comment wondering aloud what the person had on Bill that made him invulnerable, and was banned.
ReplyDeleteI posted Ken's review of the rules at my Commission and Regiment Blog, along with a lengthy and detailed analysis of what I thought of said TMP-er, and it remains one of the most favorite posts. I'm guessing because it has a review of a ruleset, more than anything witty I had to say.
TMP is modestly useful to solve gaming problems across a wide variety of periods, and it remains one of my most consistent sources of blog visits. I don't really know a substitute, but at this point I'd be willing to pay $5 / month to anyone who'll set up a direct rival and drive him out of business. The really silly thing is that one can just join over and over from various URLs, and Bill doesn't know.
The most disturbing thing about TMP and Bill is his odd relationship with Philipino transexuals, aka Ladyboys, and his even stranger defense of it as helping oppressed people due to his involvement as some sort of lay leader in the Mormon church. I'm willing to bet money, as a religious professional in an orthodox denomination, that they've no idea about it. I can categorically state for the record that helping broken people never needs to involve revealing what the brokenness is. So he should no more say that they are transexual men than that they are recovering drug addicts or alcoholics he's trying to help out.
rant over!
Rant away Alex! Your rants are always quite good.
DeleteYes I knew about Bill's strange extra curricular interests but since I wasn't paying for a subscription I didn't think twice about them. That thread about "Arrogant Americans" was, in my opinion, simply to drum up controversy and after he banned "RetroBoom" and about 25 other people (Brandon F, a published rules author, buddy of mine, and all-around good guy) in that thread, I had enough so I baited him in the hopes he'd ban me. I haven't been back since and I don't plan on it unless a Google search brings me there (in which case, I'm looking for cuff, facing, turnback or piping colors, etc).
Excellent points about Bill as well. I remember finding that post of yours and reading through it about Ken's review. That was classic unfiltered TMP at its finest.
Again, your rants are always welcome here.
Late arrival to this comment thread, but I gave up on TMP in 2012 for basically all of the above stated reasons. Just let my membership expire. I've found that I can use it as a research tool without having a membership at all.
ReplyDeleteOccasionally I will read an entire thread where guys are going hammer and tongs about whether or not Germany was called Germany by Germans before Germany was Germany, and realize I'm not missing anything.
Late reply to this post, but I feel the same way. Occasionally google searches take me there but like you, I'm not missing anything.
DeleteVery late arrival to this thread. Agree with all said above. I occasionally search Google for figures comparisons etc and invariably get sent to TMP. What an awful place. I don't think there are many threads that I have seen that don't descend into sarcasm and rudeness. The Editor is a strange one.
ReplyDeleteEven the most "normal" seeming posts seem to degenerate into sarcasm and meanness.
Delete